Richard Bertinet Wants Us to Forget Sourdough

Beginner-level bread baking gets a bad rap. But there’s nothing “less-than” about simple loaves, according to Richard Bertinet, author of six cookbooks, including his award winning debut cookbook, Dough. Not only is basic bread dough vital to your bread education, but you’ll rely on those core skills long after you’ve grown into more advanced techniques. I sat down with Richard to talk about his experience opening a cookery school, the re-release of this premier cookbook, and his upcoming Milk Street Class on May 30th, Show the Dough Who’s Boss: Fougasse with Richard Bertinet.

Not every author and chef is cut out to be a teacher. What made you decide to open up an entire cookery school and teach?

I used to run a restaurant and work in a hotel and run our kitchen—I didn't know I could teach.

I became friends with a guy who had a book out already, and he was teaching in a cooking school in London. He said, “Oh, you have to come in with me to give me a hand.” So, I went there, gave him a hand to set up, and the way he was teaching, it suddenly clicked to me that if I did it, I could make teaching fun.

I was reading a lot of bread books then, and they were crap. The way everything was explained didn't make sense to me—nevermind to somebody who never baked before. We were lucky—when we opened the school my first book came out the same week. And 20-plus years ago, a cooking school was something that didn't attract people. It was not very fashionable at the time. There were some big ones, like Le Cordon Bleu and all those, but they were a bit boring because it was not a leisurely thing you could do just for fun and learning. We put the two together.

But I was missing the restaurants, the hospitality thing, so I tried to combine everything together. We kept [the classes] very small, 12 people maximum, and we tried to include the teaching element, the learning element and the fun element. So, they learn, they cook, they bake, but it's also the hospitality. We have a great lunch, a lot of wine, we make friends, people come back—like in a restaurant. You don't want people to come once and never come back. For us, it was always to build up. To build up a school that people want to come back to more than once a year, and that's what we’ve achieved now.

We've got people coming back—it’s incredible—all the time. I had an American couple who came for years, and they didn't care which class it was, they just wanted to come here because, for them, it was the best restaurant in the world. They met new people. They had fun.

Before every class, I always get butterflies, that's never left. You know, because it's not about teaching anymore—it's performing. Also, people who saw me on TV or came earlier, the expectation is really high. I wanted to live up to that. I always feel like I've got to give more to people. Teaching was not something I knew I could do, but it's something I developed in my own style. And that's how I started, really.

What’s the one key to teaching cooking to a wide variety of students?

I start everybody the same. The hardest people to train are chefs, because they think they know better. I let them fall down first and fail—and now they're going to listen. People who don't know anything are better at learning. We try to keep everybody on the same page all the time.

I believe, when you go to a cooking school, people find it very daunting to start with, because they always think they're the worst in the class. They always think everybody is better than them, and put themselves down. The first thing we do in classes is put people at ease. We get breakfast, we have a chat first. When the laughter starts and they start to relax, then I start the class.

What’s the most critical thing for new bread makers to know?

Forget sourdough. First, learn the basics. When I start teaching, I say, “Imagine today like a jigsaw. What do you do with a jigsaw? Have you ever started a jigsaw with the middle bit? You don't. It doesn't matter how long you take to make your jigsaw—you put one piece a day. Every day you can add a bit of knowledge. The last piece in the middle is the knowledge you never get—that's where you’re trying to find [knowledge].”

[Students] want to finish everything before they even start. Start with your foundation. Your foundation will never leave you. I make [my students] use their brain before their hands.

You’re re-releasing your first book, Dough. What was the goal of this book and why is it still speaking to bakers 20 years later?

[The goal was] to teach people how to make dough properly. Every publisher I went to said, “Well, we want 200 recipes and we want sourdough.” I said, “If you put in sourdough, people will go straight to sourdough and not the basics.”

So [with] the last publisher, I lied. They let me get on with the book. I put five recipes for basic, white, olive oil, rye, brown and sweet. I'm very focused on making the dough properly. That's why I go back to the basics. There was no fancy equipment. To make bread at home properly you need only a board and scraper.

I saw it touched a nerve somewhere. You know, it was done for people, not for my ego or anything like that. And every kitchen I know in England now, they’ve all got that book on the shelf.

Your Milk Street Class spotlights fougasse. What’s special about this bread?

I will teach [the students] how to make the dough by hand. I will explain the technique, where it comes from, and how to get the basics right. I'm focusing on how to make the dough properly. Then I’ll turn the dough and show them how to shape fougasse and bake them, so they can see how it's done. You know, it was the first bread I did in my book because it looks fabulous. It's actually the easiest one to make when you know what you're doing.

Are there some helpful tips that you can give the regular home cook who is embarking on making bread at home?

All I want is to give confidence, to have a go, you know? That's why [the class] is called Show the Dough Who’s Boss—master the basics first, so you don't worry about all the recipes. Master the basics. Enjoy being in the kitchen. Enjoy cooking. Your kitchen will be a place you like. I love being there—my glass of wine, my radio, my TV. You know? I can chop and do my stuff, and cook for my friends.

If you don't like being there, it will reflect on your food. Make that place your sanctuary—where you want to be, where you want to bake, where you want to make bread. That is your place. And then you start cooking from there.

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Allie Chanthorn Reinmann

Allie Chantorn Reinmann is a Digital Staff Writer for Christopher Kimball’s Milk Street. She’s a Thai-American chef who earned her diploma for Pastry and Baking Arts at The Institute of Culinary Education and worked professionally for over a decade honing her craft in New York City at places like Balthazar, Bien Cuit, The Chocolate Room, Billy’s Bakery and Whole Foods. Allie took her know-how from the kitchen to the internet, writing about food full-time at Lifehacker for three years and starting her own YouTube channel, ThaiNYbites. You can find her whipping up baked goods for cafés around Brooklyn, building wedding cakes and trying her hand (feet?) at marathon running. She’s working on her debut cookbook and lives in Brooklyn, NY.